70. Downsizing and My Kids Don’t Want My Stuff — Now What?

A lot of people assume certain things will naturally stay in the family someday because they have been connected to holidays, routines, memories, and everyday life for so many years.

Then comes the moment when their kids politely say they do not really have room for it, need it, or want it, and that realization can land harder than people expect.

In this episode, Jodi and Heather talk about:
 • why inherited belongings can feel surprisingly emotional
 • what people are really hoping their kids hold onto
 • why younger generations often see possessions differently
 • how to ask family members about sentimental items without creating guilt or pressure
 • ways to preserve stories and memories without keeping everything
 • how to let go of items without feeling like the meaning disappears

This conversation is not really about china cabinets, collectibles, or furniture. It is about legacy, expectations, family dynamics, and the difference between passing down meaning versus passing down obligation.

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Transcript

Jodi Rosko 0:01

Welcome back to another episode of the Downsizing Roadmap Podcast with your hosts Jody Roscoe and Heather Fisher. We're talking about all things downsizing, from our own experiences with clients to guest experts. Let's make downsizing easier, one conversation at a time.

Heather Fisher 0:17

Hi, welcome to the Downsizing Roadmap Podcast. This is a great topic.

Jodi Rosko 0:23

Yeah, we hear it all the time. Yeah. Kids don't want my stuff.

Heather Fisher 0:26

Yeah. Now what do I do?

Jodi Rosko 0:28

Yeah.

Heather Fisher 0:28

I don't think we hear the now what do I do.

Jodi Rosko 0:30

No, we just hear that the kids don't want my stuff. And it um often feels like frustration or maybe sadness. You know, I think there's a little bit of um hurt around it.

Heather Fisher 0:42

Yeah. Sometimes followed with, well, I don't care. They're getting it anyway.

Jodi Rosko 0:47

Yeah. Well, they're just gonna have to deal with it all when I die. Um yeah, we hear those things too.

Heather Fisher 0:52

Yes. It can be an emotionally charged category or, you know, topic to to talk about. We'll, you know, joke because we're probably in this category a little bit ourselves, as all, you know, parents are when you hope your kids care more about what your life was like than they probably do.

Jodi Rosko 1:11

But well, I d I think they do care about what your life was like. I think they don't see it um through the stuff.

Heather Fisher 1:18

Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 1:19

And I think it's just a generational kind of change about how that is. And so I think um I think that is how people hear it is like, I don't want your stuff, therefore I don't care about you. Yeah. And that is not actually what they're seeing at all. Yeah. Um, so I think we can delve into that a little bit more today. So I'm Jodi Rosca.

Heather Fisher 1:37

I'm Heather Fisher.

Jodi Rosko 1:38

And I think of you know, people get like kind of the they hear the no thanks, thanks, no mom, thanks, um, or no dad, and they're like, oh, what? You know, and they feel like, oh, but I love that thing, and like why don't you, you know, want it too? And it's not to it's not rejection of you. And so I think that's the biggest thing to remember is that it's more of um, you know, they're trying to hold their boundaries about their own space, which probably already has too much stuff as well. Um, and they may not understand the importance of the thing that you're trying to give them because stuff is just stuff without a story, right? And so um that story may not resonate with them the way that it resonates with you. And so you may have something that really reminded you of your parents' house or your grandma's house, or you know, something that you have that reminded you of that. Um, but maybe you didn't really make that a centerpiece in your house. So then your kids don't have any memory around that thing. And so for them, you have a memory around it that brings you closer to somebody, but for them, there is no memories around that. That's why we always say if you're keeping stuff, you know, in the basement or in a storage space or you know, whatever, um, there's no memories that are be made around that. So your future the kids aren't gonna want any of that stuff because they don't they don't have any connection to it.

Heather Fisher 3:10

Yeah, we talk often that the things that your kids uh will want, and there will be a few things.

Jodi Rosko 3:16

Yeah, I mean Yeah, that would when say people say kids don't want my stuff, we're always like, that's not true. They just don't they just might not want the things you think they should want.

Heather Fisher 3:24

Yeah, and I think we talk so much about the stories around things. What a fantastic opportunity to hear those stories from your kids as to why we you know what memory they're holding around some of the random things that they feel attachment to. You know, maybe it's a candy dish that came out every, you know, holiday and they they snuck some extra candy out of the dish, or maybe it's something um, you know, that was out every year at birthdays. Uh it could be anything that resonates with their childhood, their growing up with you, and um, you know, their story.

Jodi Rosko 4:03

Well, and and the thing could be like, okay, so I have an advent calendar, um, and I did a whole thing with the kids like every year with the advent calendar, and each day it had something, you know, fun to do or something in it. Um, don't start things you don't want to keep going, guys. I'm gonna just, you know, say that. Um but that, you know, first of all, there's only one of those, and so I have two kids, so only one of them would be able to have that advent calendar. And secondly, I'm not sure it's the calendar itself at all. Like if they both went and got their own advent calendars that, you know, looked different, but kept that tradition of, you know, they loved that, that's the part they loved about it. It's not the actual physical calendar, right? Yeah. And so, you know, think about they if they're taking those those traditions or whatever that is, even if they're not taking the stuff, that's the important part, anyways. That's the part you did it for, the part you care about is the memories that they had around it.

Heather Fisher 5:04

Yeah, we just went through exactly that. I've got three kids, and only my oldest has grandkids, you know, has children of his own, uh, so grandkids, and um he called me a year or two ago on uh before Christmas. I don't have um the the talent that you have to put all the activities around the advent calendar, but we had like a wooden countdown to Christmas, you know, had little drawers for 25 days and little ornaments that went on the the little wooden uh thing that it came with. You could hang the ornaments each day as you count it down. And um, my youngest loves it the most. And but my son, my oldest, he called me and said, Hey mom, do you still have that, you know, countdown calendar? He thought his kids would really love it. And I immediately was like, Yeah, we have that, but I bet they'd love it too. And my youngest fought back and said, No, I might be 20, but I still, you know, count down this every year. You can't give that away. And, you know, in thinking about that, but I just like you said, I was able to go and find similar, the same thing, and it was that tradition that my son wanted to start with his kids that we had done with him when he was little, and it didn't matter that the one I had sent to their house, you know, was different, it wasn't the same, it was that tradition that they all loved.

Jodi Rosko 6:36

And how awesome is that? I mean, because that is so cool that that they want to carry on the tradition. That is really the most important thing.

Heather Fisher 6:43

Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 6:44

Um, so anyway, it's not the stuff that today's gener younger generations, they want um, they want mobility, they don't want to be bogged down by stuff, they want flexibility, like their their mindset around all of that stuff is different. And they don't want to spend they don't necessarily want giant houses that they fill with things, like they want more financial flexibility. Um they they value experiences over belongings. So they would rather spend time and have memories than have things. And so um, so they're more um discerning about the things that they bring in. And and so again, it's not a personal affront. Um or or you know, it's no reflection on that, uh, on you. It's just um just their different mindset around the, you know, culturally it's a different mindset.

Heather Fisher 7:35

Society has changed so much where the ease of getting household items is so different than, you know, a generation or two ago when things weren't delivered to the front door and um you know, the amount of income in a household or the number of people working in the household was smaller, and you had a need and an appreciation for just the day-to-day useful items as a young person starting out. You were starting um, you know, maybe your household in a new marriage and kids much younger, and you needed those things for the usefulness, not for the story. And so I think a lot more got passed down uh because it wasn't so easy for people to just go to IKEA or Target or whatever or Amazon it to your house. Yeah, or Amazon uh delivery to your house. Yes. Um at such a lower cost. Right. Um, so it was so different, and so we need to look at that and consider that that the things our kids want now are truly those meaningful items, and don't count on them to want, you know, your Tupperware, your dishes, your dressers, uh, because they have it themselves. Um, you know, we're living longer, so the age things are getting passed down is different. Um, and we've just all, you know, raised really independent kids. Um, you know, we talked about that spirit of independence here in America. They have their household um full of items before we're ever ready to pass down.

Jodi Rosko 9:17

Oh yeah, yeah. Yeah, because that time frame is different, right? And they're um the other thing is houses are smaller, they're they're starting to shrink, right? We went from small houses that we got, you know, in the 1940s, everybody came back from the war. We had tiny little houses, right? Tons and tons of tiny little houses. And then they just got bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. In the 80s, they got really big. In the 90s, you know, 2000s, they got really, really big. And then they've actually started to go down. They're four thousand four hundred square feet on average smaller than they were than the builds of the 2000s. And so, um, and so they have less room. They and affordability is a thing. I mean, we've we've um had a lot of inflation, which means that we had, you know, higher home prices, and so that means kids are buying homes later um in their life and they are buying smaller properties because it's just too expensive. And so they're trying not to overwhelm their space with with stuff. Um and so formal dining, that was like a whole thing. Like, so it's not that they don't like China, which is what ha where we are right now, it's that they don't have a space for it and they don't really have a use for it. You know, we used to do a lot more formal um entertaining and culturally that has declined. Dining rooms are kind of going away, they're they're becoming offices in in in a lot of newer floor plans. Um, and so like there's just less less r of that happening of that formal kind of dining the way that grandma.

Heather Fisher 10:46

Well, entertaining is not as formal as it once was. Right. It's when you have people over, it's more of that just come be part of our family routine for the evening versus a formal setting.

Jodi Rosko 10:59

Yeah. So they're not saying no because they don't like the thing or you or any of those things. They're trying to just um save their space a little bit, not be overwhelmed um by inherited stuff, um, because they already have a lot of their own stuff and they probably have more than they need of their own stuff, to be honest. So and and let's talk about what you really are actually trying to pass on because it isn't the thing. Yeah, it is the story, right? It's the story, it's um, you know, uh uh things represent things to you. They'll start to represent things to you.

Heather Fisher 11:35

Yeah, love and legacy and gratitude, um, memories, your hard work, all of those things are wrapped up. And so if you get a casual, uh no, I don't really like that, if we're tying those emotions to each particular item, it does feel like a a little ping.

Jodi Rosko 11:56

Like that was my life's work, or that was my, you know, I loved this because of this person who gave it to me, and you know, whatever it is, um, then uh the meanings can be passed on in a different way if that's what what needs to happen, but it it isn't the love isn't in the stuff. And the and the the legacy isn't necessarily in the stuff. So when we talk about uh you paring down your own things, we do talk about legacy and what you want that to be. Um and if you have something that is so you, you know, maybe you love cooking and so you have things that the kids love to make, you know, or to eat or whatever, then uh giving them y you know, a book of your recipes or something along those lines is a legacy that they probably want. They probably want that. Um which does not mean they want your you know 62 book c collection of cookbooks, right? They want the things that they remember that you made. Yeah. It's it's all much more personal now.

Heather Fisher 12:56

And there's no one better to curate that than you yourself and make it easy for them to have that collection in that small piece of this is what this represented to me, this is what I hope it means to you, and here's why, and here's this one or two things, versus well, I hope you deal with my house and take all of it. You know, those are very different.

Jodi Rosko 13:25

Yeah. And if there's things that are really important to you, um and your kids aren't are are saying they don't want them now, um, uh write the story of them. Just write the journal that thing. If you know, uh if it's something that you still love and you're still using, you can still keep it and keep that story with it and someday the kids may or may not change their mind around it, but they will love to read the story and hear the story about it and know that.

Heather Fisher 13:51

Yeah. Especially items that they may not end up uh keeping later, but just to have that story to even know um, you know, what it means to the family or whatever is a gift you can give um as they're going through things to know the difference. Did you buy this at an estate sale last week because it just looked interesting, or was this belonging to your great-great-grandmother, and you know, here's why?

Jodi Rosko 14:21

Right. And I know I've told this story before, but my grandma loved crystal and had all this crystal, and when my mom and my grandma passed away at the same time, like I didn't know any of the stories about it. And I know some of it was my great-grandma's on both sides, and some of it was my grandma's, and some of it she got for like her 50th wedding anniversary, and all the things, you know. And um when they passed away together, then that story, all of those stories were gone. I mean, we didn't all remember what was what. They could have told you. I you know, my mom could have told you, but I couldn't, you know, and and so her brothers weren't sure either. And so now it's just crystal. And so um, if there's something super important, make that make make a list of it, you know, write write the story of it so that that they know that doesn't mean they're gonna keep it either later. I don't know, but like they might really love to hear that story, and the story is what keeps the memory.

Heather Fisher 15:14

Yeah, yeah, or be just a comfort in that moment if it's yeah, being gone through because you're gone and they can um or just have that.

Jodi Rosko 15:23

This is so cool, I want it now. It was great grandma Seuss, you know, like whatever. Like, yeah.

Heather Fisher 15:28

Um, so yeah, so we usually try by just asking our kids, you know, do you want this?

Jodi Rosko 15:35

Yeah.

Heather Fisher 15:35

And that's not really a winning question.

Jodi Rosko 15:38

Yeah, they're gonna be like, no.

Heather Fisher 15:39

Yeah, no, you know, absolutely not. Um, so there's some replacement questions that might get you to a better understanding of what to keep for them or what they might want to take now, um, or what is fine to just give away if nobody's using it. Um, so a good question to ask um, is there anything here that holds meaning for you? This is that, you know, ask family before you get started on a big overhaul of getting ready for a downsizing move or just streamlining your house. Just asking, before I get started, I'm gonna be giving away a lot of things. Is there anything here that holds a lot of meaning to you? Um, they might give you some insight there. Um, is there anything that connects you to our family story? Um, I know the things I remember from my grandparents' house are different from the things my mom remembers from my grandparents' house. So, you know, there's differences because of that memory and that experience with another family member or in another environment. Um, everybody's story is different. So that might might be a different answer than you're expecting. Um, and then framing it with, you know, no pressure. Honestly, I'm letting go of some things and wanted uh to offer choices before I do. So you're not just saying, well, I I need you to take all of this. That's not gonna go so well.

Jodi Rosko 17:09

And as I, you know, I'm thinking about this with my daughter, I think, or my son, either one of them, if I just asked that question, you know, at at brunch someday, they would be like, they would not be able to think of anything. But if I'm getting rid of things and I took a quick picture of like the you know, laid out, like I'm getting rid of this stuff, yeah. Um, then they might be like, wait, hold on, like, because they don't think of that like in the moment sometimes. Like they might not think if it's if it's you know June and you're getting rid of your Christmas stuff, you know, they're not gonna be like, oh yeah, I want the advent calendar. Like they won't think about it like that. But then at Christmas, you're they're like, where's the advent calendar? And they're like, What do you mean you got rid of the advent calendar? You know, so I would just maybe quick, you know, just a quick snap picture. Hey, just this stuff, you don't have to, I'm not telling you you need to keep any, but I'm just making sure before I let it go.

Heather Fisher 18:05

Yeah, and then I think um I totally agree with that. And then back to just usefulness, I do think there's a a time to ask, is there anything here that would be helpful to your life? I know, you know, my father-in-law has much more tools at his house than my husband does. And so maybe there's a time when some, not all, you know, would go to him and be helpful to us if my father-in-law's not uh helping with those things or or things like that. But just don't make the assumption that because something was useful to you, that your kids are gonna have the same need, the same want, or the same hobby or interest in doing it. Um, but you can ask that question uh because it might be helpful to someone starting out or um that doesn't have anything to pass that on.

Jodi Rosko 19:00

And sometimes it does relate to what's happening in their life and their lifetime, right? Like, you know, my kids are in college right now, like they're not gonna need stuff now. Five years from now, they're gonna be like, hey, why'd you get rid of that, you know, KitchenAid mixer? I want it now. Well, you know, if if that's what's needs to happen in your life right now, then that's what needs to happen and they can get a new one, you know, at some point, you know. So I think um I think uh you have to be careful with like I'm gonna keep this all for them for the someday. Um you know, if they're saying if they're still in college and they're saying, I really want that, maybe you store it for a couple years. Not not tons of stuff, but you know, maybe you do. But there's times I think in life when you can, you know, they can accept things or not accept things. Stephen wouldn't have wanted the advent calendar before his kids were born, probably.

Heather Fisher 19:56

Exactly, exactly. And I I think that that's so true. And to give your per yourself permission, um, that at the time you're asking the questions, those answers are the best answers. And to to not say uh to just save it thinking, well, maybe I'll get a different answer later.

Jodi Rosko 20:14

Yeah.

Heather Fisher 20:15

Um, we see clients oftentimes that we're starting to talk to them about what's the plan for all your stuff as you get ready for this move, and they'll just kind of give an answer like, Well, I mean, I've got, you know, five grandkids and two of them are in college and they'll probably have an apartment soon. And it's just such a broad sweep of I hope I can kick this can down the road and someone will want it. Um, and I think there's so much um, so many other solutions where you could potentially help them buy a dining room table, and that replacement cost uh is probably less than you moving it, storing it, having the mental weight of something where you can just look down the road and say, you know, if they need help getting their first home set up, maybe I could um gift them a new table or something like that, and not just keep it all in the hopes.

Jodi Rosko 21:14

Right, right. So some stuff that they might want but they don't know they want, like I was talking about earlier. Um could be like your identity pieces, military stuff. Um maybe if you if you have a hobby that that you do all the time, quilting, needlepoint, you know, whatever that looks like. Maybe some of that artwork, you know, uh M um Mark's dad painted um after he retired, which was crazy. He was an engineer and so who knew he had a whole right brain side that he could um paint, but he painted um after and there was a lot of paintings and so I think that you get hung up sometimes on needing to keep it all, but just Just like photos, I think keep the ones that really resonate with you. Um but kids may want something that if you if you have a you know, a hobby that you do, um that's something that they that they may want. They may want stuff that um, you know, recipes like I said, or things that um really remind them of people who have already passed pretend, you know, maybe their grandparents or something along those lines. And they may they may want their own childhood things, but they're not gonna want a lot of them. Um maybe a book that you read to them all the time, um a piece of furniture that they grew up with.

Heather Fisher 22:36

Yeah, that's been fun uh for me as my um kids are, you know, uh my oldest two are in their early 30s and when they've brought up different things, you know, in those conversations. Remember that one book with the porcupine, and they'll talk about it, and like in that instance, like we all loved this one book, and I'm like, I think I might have it. I'm not sure if I have it, but the moment of us all talking about it and reminiscing didn't matter that we had the physical book or not, and we all talked about it and laughed. And then um, you know, just yesterday I had the kids and grandkids over, and my son said, Mom, remember that game we used to have? And he described it, and he's like, I think, you know, he said, I just was thinking about that, and he thought his son was getting to the age where he would like it, and I'm like, Yes, I do. It's in the cabinet, and I went and got it, and we all played it um last night and and taught it to my grandson. And um, you know, both ways were just as fun because it was our family, you know, carrying on a tradition and talking about it. Yeah, um, and the item was just part of the the story, and um, so don't get so hung up that every item has to be there for the memories that they hold to live on.

Jodi Rosko 24:02

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so um, so yeah, so they and they might want just a piece of something that you have. Like, you know, um my grandma had a huge um tea set, teacups um set, and they just took one. Like they they loved having tea with her, they just took one. Yeah. Um, instead of taking the you know, 60 or whatever there was there, because that seemed overwhelming. And and that's okay. And they remember having tea with her and they have the teacup, and it's okay. So don't be afraid to break up some things like that. If that's if there's um if somebody has uh a collection of things, they can take one thing of the collection and and that's okay too.

Heather Fisher 24:44

I think that's an especially good way um to give your family permission to split something up so that more people can hold on to a piece of a legacy from somebody like the teacups. Um, you know, when you're talking about, well, there's only one advent calendar, you know, something like that that's a collection. Um I know you've talked before about um making copies of a book with your grandma's uh recipes in it. Yeah. Um those are ways where you can give one item to more people and share that legacy without anyone being burdened with here's a whole kitchen worth of stuff because grandma loved to cook. Yeah. It's really changing it to a legacy item.

Jodi Rosko 25:31

Yeah, yes, yes. So um when you realize like they absolutely don't want it, right? Um, because some of it's like that no, I just don't want that. Um, then how do you release it without losing the legacy?

Heather Fisher 25:48

I'm I mean, I think we always try to find places where someone is going to love something and use it and get the rest of the life out of an item. Um, and so you can be just as comfortable knowing that that story lives on with someone you might not know. Um, I think we we talked about this in um the Swedish death cleaning book that we reviewed. Yeah, that she, the author and her friend, um, the friend had bought a desk or a table that they talked about, I wonder what stories happened before I owned it. And I think the reverse is true that when you're donating things, um, when that's hard, you know, you can just put a little imagination to what that's going to do for someone else's life and how that can live on.

Jodi Rosko 26:40

Or even you can put a note with it if you want to. And you know, like let tell the next person the story of what it is when you donate it. And I think also donating things intentionally, like, you know, maybe there's a great charity that, you know, helps sp a specific group of people that you feel like would m feel better to donate something to than not, um, maybe that's that's a way to do that. Or um I think maybe you record the stories that you have. Um yeah, when and when I'm talking about those donate, I'm talking about maybe veterans group or church groups or whatever resonates, you know, with you, shelters, um, art programs. It's there's some great places if you have hobbies that you used to do. Yeah, teachers, you looks, you know, all kinds of like things you can do.

Heather Fisher 27:24

Train clubs, um you know, there's usually a group that has even if it's a a niche hobby, there's usually a group of of other people that would really appreciate some, you know, equipment or uh things to further that hobby. Um you can um enjoy the thought of someone getting into that hobby because you've given um you know your supplies and and someone else can enjoy that and learn something new.

Jodi Rosko 27:54

Yeah. So um and you can preserve those stories. You can do that through, you know, writing the stories down, you can make videos of the stories, um, you can photograph it, you can do some things, uh voice record stories, do something along those lines so that those stories aren't lost, but you don't have to keep the things that you know with it. Yeah, the actual physical things. So um and if there are one or two things that that really really matter, not 30 things, not a hundred things, um then I then the kids need to know why and they need to know that story, and they they need you to like intentionally like sit them down and be like, hey, this is really, really important to me because and then the entire story of why it is, and it needs to be a good story. So I'll say that. Yes, yes, yeah. It's not because like you know, you went and bought it at a garage sale one day and whatever, unless that was the story because that's where you met your husband. I mean, you know, it could be anything, but like whatever.

Heather Fisher 29:01

Well, and I think the lesson to be learned from that is that if you've incorporated that story and that thing into your household through all of the time when they were living there and growing up there, they'll know how important something is to you. Yeah. And that will be the things that they can um at at least respect your love of it and um you know, whether they keep it for all of time or not, um, you know, they're holding that story too.

Jodi Rosko 29:29

Yeah, yeah. So if you want something that stays in the family, then you know, you can leave it to to somebody. Just give them not not a lot of things though. Yeah, and the reason why. And the reason why. Um and so, you know, let them choose. Um let them choose the things that they love and the things that mean things to them. Again, they won't be necessarily the things that you think they are, but it's not that they want nothing, it's just that they may not want the things that that you think that they should want.

Heather Fisher 30:02

Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Um, so you know, i in wrapping up, your life is bigger than your belongings. And I think this becomes clearer and clearer to us as we learn and and talk about this topic over and over that when you can find uh that realization that that free lightweight life you can live when you have the memories and the stories and the relationships, um, and not just a burden of things. Everything uh just feels easier and lighter and um a great place to be.

Jodi Rosko 30:41

Yeah, because what if you're what if your legacy was your stories and not your stuff, and what your gift to your kids was is not having to deal with the stuff. Because I'm gonna just say as the adult kid, um th I did need to deal that, and that was a lot, and it was very overwhelming, and it would have been awesome if that if that had been the gift to me was that you know all the stuff was narrowed down to the super important stuff, and I knew why it was super important, and you know that that that would have been amazing. So, you know, don't leave that overwhelm or the that procrastination of making decisions to your kids. That that can be such a big gift. Um so um and letting go can be part of your generosity to other people, like it's just all a mindset about you know how you're looking at it. Yeah, you can bless other people with your things, um, and it doesn't have to be your family because they're gonna get other things that that are yours that they love and they want.

Heather Fisher 31:42

Yeah. Well, we uh would love if you you know shared this episode with someone who you know might be struggling with this topic or share it with your kids as a starting point to you know how you're gonna start letting go of some stuff to make things easier for them. If there are any resources that we can help you with, um our website downsizingroadmap.com has tons of different things available. We have a free guide to get you started. That's at downsizingroadmap.com backslash guide. Or if you're ready to move forward and just need some help and um you know specifically want to talk to us or one of our agents near you, um, that's at downsizingroadmap.com backslash help, and we would love to help you. Yep. All right, we'll talk to you next time. Thank you. Thanks for joining us on the Downsizing Roadmap Podcast. If you found this episode helpful, be sure to subscribe, leave us a review, and share it with someone who might need a little downsizing inspiration. Have questions or ideas for future episodes, reach out to us on our website, www.downsizingroadmap.com. Until next time, let's keep simplifying and moving forward.